What's the Conventional Wisdom on 1L Grades Needed for Interviews in the 2L Toronto Recruit?

[Doot Universary]

Pretty much just trying to gauge my expectations at this point, and I know a few others at my school that are unsure about what grades are needed to have a good shot at landing at the very least a few interviews. I always thought that, with everything else in one's application package being "normal", a B gets you some interviews, a B+ gets you a few more, and an A- lets you all but pick where you want to go.

For reference, I'm just above a 3.5 on the year (on a traditional 4 point scale) and my most applicable EC's are having a 1L legal job, pro bono work, and membership in a club. Additionally, the school I attend usually lands in the lower 3-4 schools when it comes to OCI placement rate.

Edited May 4, 2023 by Doot Universary
Grammatical errors

[LMP]

There's going to be complicating factors, work experience, extracurriculars and a couple intangibles can factor in. 

Where you go to school also matters, a median grade at one school may yield different results than a median grade at another. 

I know you've noted all that in your post, but just to clarify for other users. 

As for your question, I'd say your biggest misconception is the strength of an A- at certian schools. It's a good grade! But it isn't exactly a free pass anywhere and everywhere. 

Beyond that you aren't far off, a B probably won't yield you too much (based on grades alone) and some people even strike out with Bs. I'd start feeling confident of OCIs around a B+ but as you've said, a higher B+ or a low A is really where you can start to see some action.

[Legally_Chase]

8 minutes ago, LMP said:

There's going to be complicating factors, work experience, extracurriculars and a couple intangibles can factor in. 

Where you go to school also matters, a median grade at one school may yield different results than a median grade at another. 

I know you've noted all that in your post, but just to clarify for other users. 

As for your question, I'd say your biggest misconception is the strength of an A- at certian schools. It's a good grade! But it isn't exactly a free pass anywhere and everywhere. 

Beyond that you aren't far off, a B probably won't yield you too much (based on grades alone) and some people even strike out with Bs. I'd start feeling confident of OCIs around a B+ but as you've said, a higher B+ or a low A is really where you can start to see some action.

How much does where you go to school matter? Could having an A- from a lower ranked school but having extensive work experience and additional EC's yield you the same results compared to someone who was on the curve (B) or above it (B+) at a higher ranked school? Asking because I definitely chose a lower ranked school for personal reasons

[QueensDenning]

10 minutes ago, Legally_Chase said:

How much does where you go to school matter? Could having an A- from a lower ranked school but having extensive work experience and additional EC's yield you the same results compared to someone who was on the curve (B) or above it (B+) at a higher ranked school? Asking because I definitely chose a lower ranked school for personal reasons

If you have an A- average at pretty much any Ontario school, you're likely to get a full slate of OCI's. Whether you get an offer is a whole other discussion. 

[LMP]

I think it's important to recognize the difference between a "full slate" and "whatever OCI you want". 

Sure, I bet you could fill up your OCIs slots if you wanted. But that could mean very little if those aren't the firms you want. 

Which is why I was pouring a bit of cold water on the A- thing. 

 

[Mal]

You'll be fine with getting interviews at all but the most elite firms. They won't impress any hiring committee once you get past the initial interview though. 

[ruthlessfox]

7 hours ago, Legally_Chase said:

How much does where you go to school matter? Could having an A- from a lower ranked school but having extensive work experience and additional EC's yield you the same results compared to someone who was on the curve (B) or above it (B+) at a higher ranked school? Asking because I definitely chose a lower ranked school for personal reasons

In general the "better" your school the deeper grades-sensitive employers are willing to dig into the class. It doesn't really matter (as much) where you go to school if you are in the top 10% of your class. But it may matter a lot more if you are at the median, or even in the bottom quartile of your class in terms of academic performance. For example, if you intend to work at an elite big-law firm, you might have to be in the top 10% of your class at Windsor, but only the top 40% of your class at UofT or Osgoode.

[vital_signs]

Can anyone provide some guidance on how many Hs a U of T student would need to guarantee being competitive in OCIs for the major firms? I know there's people who succeed across a wide spectrum of grades but I assume the students with only 1-2 Hs and the rest Ps are not typically going to Davies for instance. I'm not sure what these firms actually expect from you.
 

Kind of annoying to not know where you fall in this system. The rough top 40% estimate above is not that helpful because it's not clear what the top 40% actually is! Is that all Hs? Mostly Hs and a couple of Ps? 

Edited May 5, 2023 by vital_signs

[ruthlessfox]

6 minutes ago, vital_signs said:

Can anyone provide some guidance on how many Hs a U of T student would need to guarantee being competitive in OCIs for the major firms? I know there's people who succeed across a wide spectrum of grades but I assume the students with only 1-2 Hs and the rest Ps are not typically going to Davies for instance. I'm not sure what these firms actually expect from you.
 

Kind of annoying to not know where you fall in this system. The rough top 40% estimate above is not that helpful because it's not clear what the top 40% actually is! Is that all Hs? Mostly Hs and a couple of Ps? 

Ultra Vires does an analysis most years. Median is 5 Hs and 75th percentile is 7 Hs. 9 Hs is distinction. Keep in mind these are inflated to some extent because students with lower grades or poor recruit results are less likely to respond to the survey.