Mature Student Experience

[WSTempest21]

Hi, friends.

 

Hoping to solicit some feedback from past and present mature students at Allard. I'm hoping to better understand what student life may look like for me if I am accepted for next September.

Brief sketch of me: I am a mid-thirties, mid-career professional (unrelated to law). I have a wife and seven year-old. Coming to UBC would involve a move from Ontario, although I am from the Fraser Valley originally so know the area.

I don't want to situate any responses that I'm fortunate enough to receive here, but some of the (non-exhaustive) topics that I'm interested in hearing about:

1) Integration with KJDs and any frictions that you've experienced? If a total non-issue, I would love to hear about that too.

2) Related to the above, have you been able to find community or successfully lone wolf the experience?

3) Any general advice on how to help the family adjust to this change? Families are all different of course, but anything you could share would be very cool.

4) Any ex-military community? Definitely not a "must-have," but a point of curiosity.

5) Any other observations you could kick my way!

 

TIA!

 

 

[SNAILS]

I am a mature student graduate of Osgoode Hall.

First of all, the issues a law student might experience if they are in their 40's  or 50's are much lessened if you are only in your mid thirties (barely above the age of the KJDs). Second of all, nobody really cares about your age except in some very narrow circumstances.

1) Integration with KJDs and any frictions that you've experienced? If a total non-issue, I would love to hear about that too.

"Frictions" are a total non-issue. Frictions are way more likely to result from issues that have nothing to do with age (i.e. differing opinions of social issues; failure to pull your weight in a group project).

Law students do tend to hang out with people of similar age, culture, and interests. But this is the same outside law school. The younger people are slightly more likely to do younger people things like maybe go to a bar or go to the gym and work out, and you probably like doing more mature things like studying, calling your wife and child on the phone, and going to bed. If you are a 35 year old who likes the same things as the 22-25 year olds, your age won't stop you from hanging out with them. 

There is certainly nothing stopping you from studying with the JD's, doing group projects with them, sitting beside them in class, etc.

2) Related to the above, have you been able to find community or successfully lone wolf the experience?

I preferred to be more of a lone wolf, mostly - go back to my apartment and study a bunch, take a nap, study some more, go to class. Your age wont stop you from finding a community, if you want to hang out with other law students before and after class.

3) Any general advice on how to help the family adjust to this change? Families are all different of course, but anything you could share would be very cool.

It makes a massive difference if your family is moving with you or if your wife and child are staying where they are. I was away from my wife and daughter 5 days per week and went home on weekends. My daughter was 11 when I graduated, and I think I did miss significant parts of her growing up, which is quite a sacrifice both for yourself and for your child. I would video call ("Kids Messenger") with my daughter twice per day (before school and either after school or before bed time) for probably 15-20 minutes each. Technology is a huge blessing. I would make sure that there was family time when I came home on weekends. I would make sure my school work is done when possible on weekends to allow more family time. 

If your spouse is anything like mine, he/she'll be very proud of your for going to law school. It is a benefit to your family in the long term, and they'll see the sacrifices and efforts you are making. Make sure your family time is a routine that is integrated to your life and theirs.

Make sure your 7 year old has her own device, whether it's an iPad or an old phone with internet but no cellular plan. make sure your child knows how to call and pick up calls when you call her. Make sure you have a stand for your device so you can be on camera hands free and work on your computer while she is waking up or getting ready if you need to.

4) Any ex-military community? Definitely not a "must-have," but a point of curiosity.

There were not enough ex-military to form a community, but there are certainly some ex-military along with KJDs with military aspirations or interest.

5) Any other observations you could kick my way!

I found the KJDs, especially the women, to be a bit immature when it comes to (sometimes) hanging out in little groups and giggling, etc. That's 100% fine with me. I have no desire, and it would be quite odd, for me to take part in that. However, in a sense there is a bit of a divide between older and younger students - but its more a matter of personal choice and different interests than a matter of being excluded.

The fact of being KJD can influence views on social issues, even more so, I think, than you would find in a random sampling of 22-25 year old's who at least have life experience working for a living. It's hard to put your finger on, but you might understand that a KJDs views might be be different from a more mature persons views if:

• They are commenting on how police ought to act when they have never witnessed an arrest of a belligerent and intoxicated person
• They are commenting on what kind of taxation would be fair or not fair when they have never worked to support themselves or operated a business
• They are commenting on Indigenous people's connection to the land and spirituality when they have never spend significant (or any time!) on a reserve 

For the above reasons, older people tend to be more conservative in their views, I find.

[WSTempest21]

SNAILS,

 

Appreciate the thorough and thoughtful response. I can appreciate that I will only be a bit over a decade older than the KJDs, but I think the limitation in connection may be the life experiences within that decade (i.e. mortgage, car, stable career, wife, child, balding lol etc.) that can vary a great deal for the mid-thirties crowd. But I fully hear you there. 

 

I am actually weighing the potential of being dislocated from my family through the regular work week, so that insight was particularly helpful even though I did not think to ask it in my original post. I'm no stranger to missing out on milestones in my current vocation, so I won't make that decision lightly. Sounds like you managed to achieve a healthy balance and keep focused on the long-term good in the situation, which is quite the accomplishment from my unfortunately intimate knowledge of the lifestyle. 

 

You clearly saw to the heart of what I did post, based on your response to Q5 -- I had noticed that generational culture shift. I am confident that I have progressed with society but what I always considered to be progressive views are now a little farther right of the early-twenties demographic's zeitgeist. I guess that that's what the march of time feels like (it's not me that's out of touch, it's the children that are wrong..). The three examples you provided definitely resonate with me and I could easily picture hearing some wild hot-takes on subjects like those. I have no issues hearing these perspectives, but it will be a bit of an adjustment from my current very conservative workplace. Being honest, I would take completely ignorant left-leaning opinions than some of the stuff I hear at the moment. At the very least it will be naively optimistic rather than terminally cynical. 

 

Not sure if it was the same for you, and I do feel silly admitting it, but I am oddly self-conscious to re-enter school. After a lot of accomplishment in my first career, changing directions and essentially "starting over" is a weird feeling. Not a feeling with which I am very familiar. Thanks for giving me some ground-truth on the experience and helping me better picture the next step. From your post, it still sounds like a pretty good time. Well, for law school..

 

[Patient0L]

I’m a mature student at Allard. I would say, don’t worry so much about fitting in. I feel like they really curate the small groups well so that everybody finds their crew. Mid-thirties isn’t that old in the scheme of mature students at Allard. Also, you can’t really do anything about your age, so if there are people who are ageist, that’s their problem imo, especially because they’ll realize one day that they are old.

As far as family and kids go, my biggest piece of advice is get noise cancelling earbuds.

Edited October 26, 2024 by Patient0L

[CroffleKing]

On 10/26/2024 at 3:55 AM, SNAILS said:

I am a mature student graduate of Osgoode Hall...

I just wanted to say how much I appreciated that naps came up twice in your post. As another mature student candidate this cycle, I have asked myself when I will have time to nap and this solidifies my theory that I will be able to nap while others party without negative consequences to my experience in law school as a mature candidate.

In all seriousness, I appreciate your response and that WSTempest has posed these questions as I've found it helpful to review.

[WSTempest21]

I truly felt the "noise canceling headphones" bit deep within my marrow haha.

 

Thanks for the reply, Patient0L. 

[Patient0L]

On 10/29/2024 at 6:08 PM, WSTempest21 said:

I truly felt the "noise canceling headphones" bit deep within my marrow haha.

 

Thanks for the reply, Patient0L. 

Crucial in a Vancouver-sized condo.