How the hell do I become comepetitive for a Big Law firm?

[LegalAquinas]

Hello, on another thread I posted a question regarding Big Law in Toronto. 

 

I saw that there are thousands of applicants and most law firms take a student or two here or there. How do I become competitive for these jobs?!? I have good social skills, HIGHLY extroverted and am well read... and I have been told that I make an impression on people. People have told me I was born to be a lawyer since... well...I was born. Should I just grind the academics? softs? Like what should I do to break into the corporate machine? Do they care I do jiu jitsu and speak latin or should I just focus on my grades?

Help is appreciated...

 

Also, i'm new to this forum and seeing some regular popper-uppers (big shoutout to @MyWifesBoyfriend for always responding promptly). 

[Chef Justice]

Grades above all else.

While speaking another language, knowing a martial art, having cool hobbies, etc. are all great, none of that will matter if you are a below-average student.

Undergraduates and 1Ls put a lot of emphasis on extracurriculars like they will make a huge difference in their applications. 

My advice is to first get into law school.

After that, try to find one or two extracurriculars you enjoy: clubs, journals or clinics. You want to show that you are at least somewhat involved in your law school community and can speak to those things in interviews. 

Do not engage in more extracurriculars to the detriment of your grades. 

How competitive your grades need to be depends on the law school you attend. At Queen's, Western, and Osgoode having a B+ average will make you competitive, with a few A-range grades sprinkled in. UofT will give you a bit more leeway (and have a different grading system) - I assume being in the H range makes you competitive.

 

 

[Pantalaimon]

Be relatively normal and get good grades. Both are apparently difficult for most law students, so that's basically the whole ball game.

[Wemby]

Get good grades. However, good grades are far from a guarantee—they will get you interviews, but it's up to you to convince your interviewers to hire you. I had to learn the hard way that most interviewees have stellar grades and that I needed to differentiate myself!

Edited January 11 by Wemby

[StoneMason]

4 hours ago, Chef Justice said:

UofT will give you a bit more leeway (and have a different grading system) - I assume being in the H range makes you competitive.

 

Sharing for reference (may be helpful for future lurkers): assuming an otherwise polished application, having 3-4 Hs in first year puts you around the 50th percentile and is more than enough to land big law in Toronto. Some even land sister firms with median grades (although, some of the sister firms are more grade-selective than others). 

[Mal]

Big Toronto law firms don't just take a "student or two", most of the larger employers take in the range of 20 to 40 each year (there were around 400 people hired in the summer recruit in 2024). There are a lot of jobs in Toronto, all you need is to do well in school (be in the upper quartile of students at most Canadian schools) and be a fairly ordinary person with a bit of luck.

PS. I have found that people that say or are told they are "born to be lawyers" are not actually natural lawyers. It's a platitude that people say when someone comes across as convincing in social settings, which is usually just a proxy for social skills. No one says it to the quiet introverted kid who is obsessed with word puzzles and spends all their time reading. 

Edited January 11 by Mal

[SNAILS]

I have repeatedly stated my opinion that getting into "big law" is over rated, like some kind of holy grail. If you get into law school, you have a good shot if you get high or even above average grades. Otherwise, there are many other rewarding, enjoyable, challenging and high paying jobs for lawyers out there. 

[MyWifesBoyfriend]

2 hours ago, SNAILS said:

"big law" is over rated

Depends. U of T often leads to a pretty high debt load, so there's a reason why it's the "holy grail" in that context. 

On 1/10/2025 at 6:15 PM, LegalAquinas said:

I have good social skills, HIGHLY extroverted and am well read... and I have been told that I make an impression on people. People have told me I was born to be a lawyer since...

Could help with networking, but largely irrelevant since it ultimately turns on grades and competitive ECs (law review). 

Also, @Mal sort of teased this point out, but just from reading between the lines, this part of the post rubs me the wrong way. Confidence is fine, but too much can come off as arrogance. It's a balancing act. 

Edited January 12 by MyWifesBoyfriend

[TimbitPancake]

On 1/10/2025 at 3:15 PM, LegalAquinas said:

Hello, on another thread I posted a question regarding Big Law in Toronto. 

 

I saw that there are thousands of applicants and most law firms take a student or two here or there. How do I become competitive for these jobs?!? I have good social skills, HIGHLY extroverted and am well read... and I have been told that I make an impression on people. People have told me I was born to be a lawyer since... well...I was born. Should I just grind the academics? softs? Like what should I do to break into the corporate machine? Do they care I do jiu jitsu and speak latin or should I just focus on my grades?

Help is appreciated...

 

Also, i'm new to this forum and seeing some regular popper-uppers (big shoutout to @MyWifesBoyfriend for always responding promptly). 

Hi LegalAquinas!

Feel free to take my notes with a grain of salt as I'm only a 1L though I'd like to think that I can offer a perspective having worked for almost a decade in the tech industry prior to law school.

I've had some coffee chats with articling students and associates and came along some concepts of what a firm may be looking for:

• "will this person fit our culture?"
• "you're going to be stuck with this person in a boardroom for a few hours, it's in everyone's favour that you get along with them"
• "the loudest in the room may not be most suitable for the firm"

What an ideal candidate looks like is up to anyone's guess, other than the hiring committee. I can imagine that a person may be suitable for one firm and not for another etc.

From from my professional experience, I can say that some people who I worked with had great hard skills but did not have the soft skills to become successful within the team or department.

If I had to give you one tip, I'd say not to assume that being extroverted is a requirement to in landing a biglaw job.

If you're competing with someone who has similar grades and experiences, it may all come down to how you vibe with the people at the firm. Perhaps, being extroverted does not vibe well with the people and they may choose another person instead of you. On the flip-side, being extroverted is something another firm might look for. As it's always said in law, it all depends.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any questions!

Edited January 13 by TimbitPancake

[LegalAquinas]

21 hours ago, MyWifesBoyfriend said:

Depends. U of T often leads to a pretty high debt load, so there's a reason why it's the "holy grail" in that context. 

Could help with networking, but largely irrelevant since it ultimately turns on grades and competitive ECs (law review). 

Also, @Mal sort of teased this point out, but just from reading between the lines, this part of the post rubs me the wrong way. Confidence is fine, but too much can come off as arrogance. It's a balancing act. 

My hubris may have gotten to better of me in me seeking information. 

 

Mea culpa, 

[BeesKnees]

I’m sorry dude. I don’t mean to be rude but your ego is bursting out of my phone reading this. As a lawyer who has hired candidates for a biglaw firm, this would really be off putting. Please, take a step back and try to learn some humility if such a thing can actually be learnt. Just be authentic, try to appreciate others and work hard. Calm down. 

[Chef Justice]

I think he got the point.

[MyWifesBoyfriend]

4 hours ago, Chef Justice said:

 

I think he got the point.

 

Yeah, but we’re overdue for the annual tar-and-feather thread.

[VarsityBlues]

For biglaw, your grades will be your primary predictor of success. Only As and Bs in 1L. If you can't manage this, it will be difficult to be competitive, even if you get interviews due to other strengths. 

In 1L, soft skills are just as crucial (Law review, mooting, etc.), and networking is key. Build relationships with people at biglaw firms, attend events, and get involved in law school activities. Firms want to see you’re more than just a flashy transcript; they want someone who can connect with clients and work well with teams.

Generally, you need to focus on both: grind your academics while also building a solid network and reputation for being a well-rounded, approachable, and capable future lawyer. Stay active, be visible, and show you’re genuinely interested in corporate law. 

You'll be competing with students who excel academically with impressive softs. Good luck. 

[Milareen]

Grades are important, gotta show you can handle the workload. But they also want to see you're a well-rounded person. Your social skills and extroverted personality are a huge plus. Big Law is client-facing, so being able to connect with people is key. Definitely grind on the academics, but don't ditch the "softs."

[Turtles]

As a reminder, there is no "right" big law personality, and even at the same firm there can be a multiplicity of personalities across practice groups. Firms look to find people who will fit in. If you're playing up extroversion at a firm that sees itself as "academic" with interviewers that tend to say less but put more thought into their words before they say it, you are probably not doing yourself any favours. Being able to talk in circles while saying very little of relevant substance is a great way for others to view you as ditzy or nothing more than a used car salesman, let alone as "too much" or "probably hard to get focussed or to work with". 

In contrast to personality, there are soft skills that are universally sought, like being able to listen, being able to demonstrate empathy, letting people finish their sentences before butting in, and so fourth. "Extroversion" (as vs "introversion") is a wholly separate matter: introverts can readily smile, greet people, be pleasant to be around, and build relationships. Extroversion is not a strength or a weakness -- what matters are one's actual soft skills.  

Applicants sometimes get this confused. Try thinking about the firms (and their practice areas) you are applying to and the people that currently fit in there. 

[Kimura]

Grades are the biggest determinant, though having work experience in a specific practice area really helped me land my gig in big law (despite the fact that I pivoted away from that area throughout my articling).

As an aside, is there a specific reason you want to go all in on big law? Going into law school, I set my sight on big law because of the money. Within my first year of call I realized the money wasn't worth it and bowed out to government, where I am now much, much happier. 

P.s. one of the things I couldn't do as much while I was in practice is BJJ (I trained at most once a week). Now I train 3-5 times a week. Life is good. 

[MyWifesBoyfriend]

@Turtles are there any firms that hire socially awkward weirdos? 

Asking for a friend. 

[BlockedQuebecois]

4 hours ago, MyWifesBoyfriend said:

@Turtles are there any firms that hire socially awkward weirdos? 

Asking for a friend. 

Just check if they have a tax group.