Should I participate in the articling recruit?

[uoftearsalumna]

Based on my situation, I am wondering if I should apply for the Toronto articling recruit taking place this summer. Going to try and summarize my situation as clearly as possible and any comments/feedback would be appreciated. Keep it cool and nice :))

Work Experience:

I have a job this summer at a boutique firm in the Bay Street area. It specializes in one-two practice areas, but will gain valuable experience working directly with former bay street partners. There is a possibility of articling but I am interested more in full service. Though, to my understanding, full service options are limited in the articling recruit. The limitation in options is something discouraging me from the articling recruit because I am not interested in public sector work or other types of law I am aware of that mainly hire through articling (ie: crim defence, PI, etc). Prior work experience before law school includes corporate work. 

Grades

I am, and always will be, a B-average student. I’ve been able to slide in very few A’s via advocacy competitions or external assignments for credit, but am otherwise prone to B/B- grades. This is the primary reason for my lack of success in 2L, but I have heard from countless people who got hired through articling recruit at various types of firms that grades become less and less of a factor with each recruit. So I interpret this is as grades are considered, but work experience will be highly looked at? Are grades still the #1 filter? 
 

PTSD From 2L Recruit

It would be impossible for me to contemplate the articling recruit without reflecting on my experience in 2L, which was one of the lowest points of my life. Sure, “it’s just a job” and I’ll look back at it years down the line when I get to the firm of my dreams one day and think why did I react like that, but I’ve never felt lower of myself than during and after the 2L recruit. It’s not just the fact that I didn’t get the job, but it’s the working so hard for something for over a year (as every decision I made in 1L was in contemplation of how that would translate to interviews/help me in my work experience during my 2L summer at a Bay Street firm), and that hard work blowing up in my face. Yes, I am responsible for my average 1L grades (see my prior posts) which were the biggest barrier of my 2L recruit success, but I tried to make the best of a bad situation and make due with what little I had by networking/going to events/spending thousands on career coaches to tailor my resume and cover letters as near perfectly as possible… and it was that false/blind hope that really got to me when I didn’t get an offer. I recognize the pressure is slightly reduced as I have a job with a potential for articling so I can fall back on that, but I’ve worked so hard with professional help to get to a better place I worry about the articling recruit undoing all of that. 
 

That’s where my head is at. Thanks. 

Edited May 9 by uoftearsalumna

[Dinsdale]

I assume from your handle you are at U of T law.  "B" students from U of T get hired.  You are probably not going to get hired back at your 2L summer firm (from the sounds of it).  So why not apply everywhere and see what happens?  What do you possibly have to lose?  Even if you strike out and your current firm doesn't hire you back, there's always the LPP.

On the other hand, if your 2L summer firm offers you an articling position in July, that makes the calculation much tougher.  If you like the people and the work, I would take the offer.  But so many factors go into that decision, which is yours to make.

[uoftearsalumna]

4 minutes ago, Dinsdale said:

I assume from your handle you are at U of T law.  "B" students from U of T get hired.  You are probably not going to get hired back at your 2L summer firm (from the sounds of it).  So why not apply everywhere and see what happens?  What do you possibly have to lose?  Even if you strike out and your current firm doesn't hire you back, there's always the LPP.

On the other hand, if your 2L summer firm offers you an articling position in July, that makes the calculation much tougher.  If you like the people and the work, I would take the offer.  But so many factors go into that decision, which is yours to make.

Thanks for your reply, want to clarify 2 things:

-  I am not uoft law, I am western law 

-  my current summer firm is looking to grow, with the possibility of articling as they typically have an articling student. I guess that depends on the vibes and if I like the work as you said. 

Edited May 9 by uoftearsalumna

[Dinsdale]

OK.  Western is a notch below U of T, obviously, but "B" students from Western get articling positions all the time.  Maybe not at the biggest firms, but still.

In early July (before the articling application deadline) politely ask your current firm if they are able to declare their intentions towards you.  Be transparent with them. Assuming, of course, that you would like to return to article.

[BlockedQuebecois]

1 hour ago, Dinsdale said:

"B" students from U of T get hired.

I would bet you $10k that not a single student with a B-average in 1L from U of T got hired in the 2L recruit this year! 

[Constantine]

OP, Just do it. Don't let your dreams be dreams.

 

Edited May 10 by Constantine

[Dinsdale]

20 hours ago, BlockedQuebecois said:

I would bet you $10k that not a single student with a B-average in 1L from U of T got hired in the 2L recruit this year! 

Sorry, but that is a ridiculous statement.  I was not involved in the recruit this year but I have been in many years previously.  Precedent tells us that 317 2L's were hired by the 16 biggest firms.  Another 20-25 mid-sized and boutique firms also participate, so we can approximate that about 400 2L's were hired.  From my experience, when overall numbers were similar, that means 75-80 U of T 2L's were hired.  Are you telling me the 80th student at U of T has better than a B- average?  If so, grade inflation is rampant there.

Edited May 10 by Dinsdale

[BHC1]

41 minutes ago, Dinsdale said:

Sorry, but that is a ridiculous statement.  I was not involved in the recruit this year but I have been in many years previously.  Precedent tells us that 317 2L's were hired by the 16 biggest firms.  Another 20-25 mid-sized and boutique firms also participate, so we can approximate that about 400 2L's were hired.  From my experience, when overall numbers were similar, that means 75-80 U of T 2L's were hired.  Are you telling me the 80th student at U of T has better than a B- average?  If so, grade inflation is rampant there.

I thought they were messing? It’s technically true.

Edited May 10 by BHC1

[BlockedQuebecois]

Not a single person who got a B-average in 1L at U of T has been hired by a Bay Street firm in the recruit since at least 2013! 

Edited May 10 by BlockedQuebecois

[Dinsdale]

56 minutes ago, BlockedQuebecois said:

Not a single person who got a B-average in 1L at U of T has been hired by a Bay Street firm in the recruit since at least 2013! 

Ok, ok.  A "P" average then.  Same difference.

[BHC1]

On 5/9/2024 at 10:02 AM, uoftearsalumna said:

Though, to my understanding, full service options are limited in the articling recruit. The limitation in options is something discouraging me from the articling recruit because I am not interested in public sector work or other types of law I am aware of that mainly hire through articling (ie: crim defence, PI, etc). 

Sorry: I got too distracted by the stupid joke above and realized I didn’t actually contribute anything to your request for input.

First, I recall in another topic you mentioned you were not doing well and drinking more alcohol after striking out in the 2L recruit. Sounds like you were able to turn things around pretty quickly, faster than most. Glad things improved for you. I hope in the future these kind of things don’t set you on a downward spiral and that you’ve built up some resilience through this experience. 

Just remember that a bird in the hand is often worth more than two in the bush. As you’ve pointed out, the number of firms participating in this recruit that interest you are not particularly high. You may end up participating in this recruit and end up only with job offers at firms that do work that interests you even less than the two practice areas that your summer firm specializes in. I would recommend you work diligently this summer and see if you can get hired back for articling, then weigh your options from there before committing to participating in the recruit or not. 

Finally, you absolutely should not pursuit the articling recruit without first discussing things with your current firm - ideally after you’ve had some time to work there and they have a better idea about whether they want to hire you back or not. While the process is ostensibly confidential, it’s a small legal community. Things could end badly for you if you’re not forthright. 
 

Best of luck whatever your decision. You’ve come a long way and your hard work is paying off. 

 

 

 

 

 

[uoftearsalumna]

9 hours ago, BHC1 said:

Sorry: I got too distracted by the stupid joke above and realized I didn’t actually contribute anything to your request for input.

First, I recall in another topic you mentioned you were not doing well and drinking more alcohol after striking out in the 2L recruit. Sounds like you were able to turn things around pretty quickly, faster than most. Glad things improved for you. I hope in the future these kind of things don’t set you on a downward spiral and that you’ve built up some resilience through this experience. 

Just remember that a bird in the hand is often worth more than two in the bush. As you’ve pointed out, the number of firms participating in this recruit that interest you are not particularly high. You may end up participating in this recruit and end up only with job offers at firms that do work that interests you even less than the two practice areas that your summer firm specializes in. I would recommend you work diligently this summer and see if you can get hired back for articling, then weigh your options from there before committing to participating in the recruit or not. 

Finally, you absolutely should not pursuit the articling recruit without first discussing things with your current firm - ideally after you’ve had some time to work there and they have a better idea about whether they want to hire you back or not. While the process is ostensibly confidential, it’s a small legal community. Things could end badly for you if you’re not forthright. 
 

Best of luck whatever your decision. You’ve come a long way and your hard work is paying off. 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you so much, I really appreciate it :)