Where would you go? UofA, Dal, Ryerson

[RC51]

Hey gang. Where would you go if you were in my shoes?

Destinations: 1. Vancouver 2. Toronto

Goals:

- Would like to have the option for BL, but not necessary.

My CGPA is terrible so I don't think I will get many more acceptances this cycle, maybe Queens or Western if I am lucky. 

Ryerson seems to be the least amount of work as I live in Toronto now and have a place I can stay. But its a local school, I'd need to check, but not sure if anyone is summering in Vancouver which could give me more hope. 

UofA is close to the Vancouver Market, good national reputation. Never been to Edmonton, heard its boring there which is fine with me, but I don't like the flatness of the city. 

Dal is has a great national reputation, but I am unfamiliar with Halifax and Halifax is physically the opposite direction of both markets that I am interested in, not a big deal, but do west coast firms even do OCIs at Dal? 

 

Edited February 8, 2022 by RC51

[QMT20]

Although U of A is closest to Vancouver, they don't necessarily have an advantage over Dal for Vancouver big law (see here). Dal also definitely does better for the Toronto recruit (see here). 

I would probably pick Dal if I were in your situation, even though Alberta is closer to Vancouver. I don't know if Vancouver firms do OCIs at Dal but they used to have a joint OCI for a bunch of Ontario law schools. At Queen's, I don't think anyone who wanted to go to Vancouver had too much trouble doing so through that process. They may have something similar for Dal that's not quite an "on campus" interview but provides a pre-in firm stage opportunity. 

For Toronto, Dal definitely has an advantage. Prior to COVID all the big Toronto firms were doing "on campus" OCIs at Dal and not all of them were doing Alberta. Now that OCIs are over Zoom, a lot of firms have expanded their applicant pools and are doing OCIs at schools that they didn't recruit as many students from in the past. If you do really well at Alberta, I think the door to Toronto big law would be open to you but it would be easier to come to Toronto from Dal. 

If you got into Queen's or Western though, I might pick one of them over Dal for access to both Vancouver and Toronto. Both of those schools place much more than Dal does for Toronto big law. People from Dal will probably say that a lot of students self-select out of Toronto/Vancouver but that's difficult to actually quantify and at the end of the day, you don't seem to want to work in Halifax. For Vancouver, you'd also have access to the joint OCIs that the Vancouver firms host for Ontario law students and Queen's places about the same number there as Dal. I can also say anecdotally that for the years when I was at Queen's, the students from BC who wanted to go back to Vancouver didn't seem to have any trouble in the Vancouver recruit. 

[Ice]

@QMT20 Do you know why schools like UofA, UofC and UBC barely place any students in the 2L Toronto recruit? Are most firms just not interviewing there, or is there a lack of interest from students in applying for those positions?

Edited February 8, 2022 by Ice

[CleanHands]

13 minutes ago, Ice said:

@QMT20 Do you know why schools like UofA, UofC and UBC barely place any students in the 2L Toronto recruit? Are most firms just not interviewing there, or is there a lack of interest from students in applying for those positions?

As a UBC grad, anecdotally few of my classmates participated in the Toronto recruit. Most of those who did also participated in the Vancouver recruit (and often the Alberta recruit), and offers for the Vancouver (and Alberta) recruit are made prior to the Toronto recruit, so those participating in both who receive a Vancouver offer would withdraw their Toronto applications. I am one of those who accepted an offer elsewhere while I had a 2nd round interview in Toronto pending (only Toronto position I applied for) that I withdrew from. Very, very few of my classmates were dead set on working in Toronto, and those who were didn't seem to face significant hurdles making that happen.

I am open to correction, but I don't believe that interest and participation in the Toronto recruit among students at western schools (and the above variables) are tracked statistically. But it was clear enough being part of one of those cohorts that it's not as if students there are clambering to work on Bay Street and getting rejected left and right.

[QMT20]

3 hours ago, Ice said:

@QMT20 Do you know why schools like UofA, UofC and UBC barely place any students in the 2L Toronto recruit? Are most firms just not interviewing there, or is there a lack of interest from students in applying for those positions?

 

2 hours ago, CleanHands said:

As a UBC grad, anecdotally few of my classmates participated in the Toronto recruit. Most of those who did also participated in the Vancouver recruit (and often the Alberta recruit), and offers for the Vancouver (and Alberta) recruit are made prior to the Toronto recruit, so those participating in both who receive a Vancouver offer would withdraw their Toronto applications. I am one of those who accepted an offer elsewhere while I had a 2nd round interview in Toronto pending (only Toronto position I applied for) that I withdrew from. Very, very few of my classmates were dead set on working in Toronto, and those who were didn't seem to face significant hurdles making that happen.

I am open to correction, but I don't believe that interest and participation in the Toronto recruit among students at western schools (and the above variables) are tracked statistically. But it was clear enough being part of one of those cohorts that it's not as if students there are clambering to work on Bay Street and getting rejected left and right.

I agree with what @CleanHands said but I would distinguish between UBC and U of A/Calgary. As far as I know, all the Bay Street firms did OCIs at UBC before COVID-19. Some Bay Street firms probably did OCIs at U of A and Calgary but not all of them did. You can check the "Campus Recruiting" section of NALP to confirm that. This is significant because it means 20+ students are getting interviews at UBC and Dal for each firm vs something like 2-3 who get invited directly to in firm interviews from non-OCI schools. 

I think the advantage of going to Queen's or Western over UBC for Toronto big-law largely boils down to convenience from geographic proximity. However, I think going to Queen's, Western or Dal for Toronto big-law over a non-OCI school from another province is a huge advantage. There's a much broader pool of students who pass the initial filter for an interview. Again I think some Toronto firms did OCIs at U of A/Calgary pre-pandemic and that number likely went up when OCIs went to Zoom so the door isn't closed. It's just a more direct path from an OCI school.