TRU vs Queens (BC Resident)

[Stino]

Hi everyone! This is my first post here.

 

I am a little conflicted, as up until now I fully intended to attend TRU. I even turned down an acceptance to Dalhousie earlier in the cycle.

 

The advice that lead me to that decision was from family and friends (some lawyers) in Vancouver, who said that there wouldn’t be a noticeable difference between the two in terms of landing a job in Vancouver. Some even said it may be best to attend TRU as I’d be closer for interviews etc. 

 

I know I’d like to ultimately work in the Vancouver area (already lived ~5 years in Ottawa for my undergrad). I may be a slightly older-than-average applicant at 26, and would prefer to stay close for family now for personal reasons, but TRU is my only option in BC this cycle. My gut feeling is still to stay close. 

 

However, today I received an offer from Queens, which is starting to make me question all of this. I’m not saying it is necessarily a “better” school than Dalhousie, but its prominence in terms of journals, reputation etc is making me question TRU, especially because I am unsure about the damage TRUs current admissions blunder may have on their reputation in the future. 
 

Any advice, or even information / opinions that I should consider, would be greatly appreciated! Essentially, am I crazy for still considering TRU over Queens given my circumstances? I’ve been weighing the options myself and thought some outside input might be helpful. 
 

Thanks! 

[NowOrNever]

23 minutes ago, Stino said:

especially because I am unsure about the damage TRUs current admissions blunder may have on their reputation in the future. 

Now USask has the same issue:

https://canlawforum.com/topic/334-usask-deferring-acceptances/?tab=comments#comment-3205

[Stino]

39 minutes ago, NowOrNever said:

Now USask has the same issue:

https://canlawforum.com/topic/334-usask-deferring-acceptances/?tab=comments#comment-3205

Hadn’t seen that yet! What a year. 

[NowOrNever]

47 minutes ago, Stino said:

Hadn’t seen that yet! What a year. 

I am sorry for the affected applicants but on the other hand TRU is getting stronger students.

[pinball]

I recognize this is completely anecdotal, but in my year at Queen's, of the 6 students with BC ties who applied for the Vancouver 2L recruit, 5 of them were successful in obtaining a position. 

If you think there's any possibility that you would want to work outside of BC in your legal career, you may want to give Queen's a strong consideration - as long as you have ties to BC, you'll be fine for the Vancouver recruit. If you want to stay in BC for personal family-related reasons, that's fine too, but just recognize that TRU doesn't really have a national reach.

[Stino]

53 minutes ago, pinball said:

I recognize this is completely anecdotal, but in my year at Queen's, of the 6 students with BC ties who applied for the Vancouver 2L recruit, 5 of them were successful in obtaining a position. 

If you think there's any possibility that you would want to work outside of BC in your legal career, you may want to give Queen's a strong consideration - as long as you have ties to BC, you'll be fine for the Vancouver recruit. If you want to stay in BC for personal family-related reasons, that's fine too, but just recognize that TRU doesn't really have a national reach.

Thanks pinball! This is actually very helpful and the exact sort of information I’m looking for in making my decision. 
 

As of now I don’t foresee myself leaving BC. I have fairly strong personal, family and professional ties here, as well as a business with steady clients that pretty much operates itself now, and which I am in the process of handing over to a partner. 
 

On the other hand, who knows what will happen in the future. The national reach Queens has is something to keep in mind. 
 

I’ll definitely be taking your experience into consideration! 

Edited June 24, 2021 by Stino

[QMT20]

I had the same experience as Pinball with my classmates at Queen's who wanted to go back to BC. I knew 4 people who applied to full service firms in Vancouver in my year and all 4 landed. I've also known 4 people who landed BCCA clerkships in the last 3 years from Queen's, including one person who was an Ontario resident that applied to BCCA as an additional court. If you go to Queen's and you want to go back to BC, you won't be disadvantaged in terms of the opportunities you'd have access to compared to in province schools. 

However, it will be more inconvenient for you to apply to Vancouver compared to if you went to TRU. Most of the career office events are catered towards Toronto and Ottawa so you'll have to do more leg work to stay on top of recruitment dates and events for Vancouver firms. I believe Vancouver firms host a single OCI for a lot of Ontario law schools in Toronto every year so your "OCI" also won't really be on campus. While our reading week is catered to Toronto in firm interview week, Vancouver in firm interviews happen earlier and you'd have to take time off from school to fly across the country for your interviews. Those are more inconveniences than they are closed doors, but they're additional burdens you'd face compared to someone who went to school in province. 

I don't think TRU's enrollment mistake is going to damage their reputation in the eyes of employers. It might damage their reputation for some applicants, though others on this site have disagreed with me about that, but employers aren't likely going to stop hiring from TRU for something like this. Like NoworNever said, if it leads to TRU having a stronger class, then if anything hiring might be stronger. But time will tell about that. 

If I were you, I'd ask myself how important it is to be close to my family. If that's really a determining factor for you, then go to TRU. It's a fine law school and if you do well you'll have good opportunities in BC when you graduate. If that's not a determining factor for you, and if the costs of going to the two schools aren't too different (including the costs you'd have to incur during Vancouver recruitment), then I'd pick Queen's. While it's inconvenient to apply to BC from Queen's, I don't think you're losing any advantage to TRU in terms of the opportunities you might have available to you in the province. You'd also have more opportunities in Toronto and Ottawa if you do end up changing your mind about where you want to work or what you want to do. 

Edited June 24, 2021 by QMT20

[Stino]

1 hour ago, QMT20 said:

I had the same experience as Pinball with my classmates at Queen's who wanted to go back to BC. I knew 4 people who applied to full service firms in Vancouver in my year and all 4 landed. I've also known 4 people who landed BCCA clerkships in the last 3 years from Queen's, including one person who was an Ontario resident that applied to BCCA as an additional court. If you go to Queen's and you want to go back to BC, you won't be disadvantaged in terms of the opportunities you'd have access to compared to in province schools. 

However, it will be more inconvenient for you to apply to Vancouver compared to if you went to TRU. Most of the career office events are catered towards Toronto and Ottawa so you'll have to do more leg work to stay on top of recruitment dates and events for Vancouver firms. I believe Vancouver firms host a single OCI for a lot of Ontario law schools in Toronto every year so your "OCI" also won't really be on campus. While our reading week is catered to Toronto in firm interview week, Vancouver in firm interviews happen earlier and you'd have to take time off from school to fly across the country for your interviews. Those are more inconveniences than they are closed doors, but they're additional burdens you'd face compared to someone who went to school in province. 

I don't think TRU's enrollment mistake is going to damage their reputation in the eyes of employers. It might damage their reputation for some applicants, though others on this site have disagreed with me about that, but employers aren't likely going to stop hiring from TRU for something like this. Like NoworNever said, if it leads to TRU having a stronger class, then if anything hiring might be stronger. But time will tell about that. 

If I were you, I'd ask myself how important it is to be close to my family. If that's really a determining factor for you, then go to TRU. It's a fine law school and if you do well you'll have good opportunities in BC when you graduate. If that's not a determining factor for you, and if the costs of going to the two schools aren't too different (including the costs you'd have to incur during Vancouver recruitment), then I'd pick Queen's. While it's inconvenient to apply to BC from Queen's, I don't think you're losing any advantage to TRU in terms of the opportunities you might have available to you in the province. You'd also have more opportunities in Toronto and Ottawa if you do end up changing your mind about where you want to work or what you want to do. 

Thanks so much for this QMT20! There’s a lot to unpack here, and your experience & knowledge give me some better insight into exactly what the impact of each decision could be, so I greatly appreciate that! 
 

I understand that it may seem strange that I’m even considering TRU over Queens, but as you noted this is primarily due to my particular family situation, yes. It’s not a dealbreaker entirely, but definitely something I need to keep in mind.

 

Just looking to get as much information as possible so that I can properly weigh the pros and cons, so thank you again for the detail!

 

cheers

[Electricity]

Hey Stino, 

Queen's publishes employment data for recent grads. I've linked it here: https://law.queensu.ca/programs/jd/student-development/employment-data. The percentage of students who work in British Columbia after graduation hovers around 5-6% (2018-2020), and B.C. students represent 6% of the class of 2023 (https://law.queensu.ca/programs/jd/class-stats). The incoming class charts only provide data for this year, but I'm guessing it's been fairly consistent at 5-7% in recent years. 

This seems to conform with some of the anecdotes provided above, so it's worth considering. Best of luck in your decision. 

[LawyerBoy11]

I’d go with Queens. Older school and perception of a more demanding admission process and more thorough and rigorous education (may be invalid but perceptions matter). Will open more doors for you. 

[GGrievous]

I think this decision ultimately comes down to your personal family reasons, no one can really make that call. You have an opportunity to stay with your family and get a law degree, and likely be fine finding work in Vancouver and more conveniently, which is your goal anyway. I'd personally say stick with TRU. 

Edited August 15, 2021 by Barry