Lateral move on Bay St

[Pancake2024]

Hello,

At the mid-level associate/senior associate level (or even junior associate if you did so), what led you to lateral?

I am at a typical bay st firm. I have interest from other typical bay st firms. 

I know some of the competitor firms are handing out significantly larger bonuses as compared to mine. I also know the firms I can work at pay their partners (particular equity partners) more because of the profit generated.

Would this be enough for you to lateral, if your sole goal is to be an equity partner?

Or more broadly, what do you think justifies a lateral move at the associate level? 

My question is specific to Toronto, and the sisters, along with firms similar to them.

Thank you 

Edited February 8 by Pancake2024

[Cool_name]

reasons to change
1. Money

2. Trying to change practice area

3. The people you work with are terrible

4. variety 

 

If you are just moving for money, it’s got to be more than a possible 10 to 15% to make up for the risk imo. As a mid level associate you are clearly liked at your firm, for whatever reason that may not be the case at the next firm.

[JurisPrudent]

If you are a mid-level/senior associate and your sole goal is to become an equity partner, then you need to consider (i) what is the path to achieving that goal at your current firm and (ii) if there are hurdles to achieving that goal at your current firm, can those hurdles be overcome by moving to a firm across the street.

Those hurdles could include:

- There not being enough work in your group at your current firm to justify adding new partners

- There being new junior partners recently promoted in your group/associates ahead of you likely to block your path to partnership

- You not being viewed internally as a viable candidate for partnership (which could be for a variety of reasons)

If the group at your firm is just slow or if there are others ahead of you in the pipeline, then a lateral move may make sense. If what's blocking that path is you, then a lateral move is unlikely to help and you should instead concentrate on working on whatever those actual or perceived deficiencies are.

Ultimately, the decision as to whether to promote someone to equity partnership depends on whether there is a business case for doing so. It's generally not a question of "do we like this associate and do they do good work" but instead "does it make business sense for the firm to add this person to our ownership group". Want to be an equity partner? Build yourself a business case and make yourself indispensable. If the opportunity to build that business case isn't available at your current firm for reasons that are outside your control - then it may make sense to look at options across the street (but, as Cool-name noted, leaving a firm where you are known and liked comes with risk, so shouldn't be done lightly).

[Pancake2024]

2 hours ago, Cool_name said:

reasons to change
1. Money

2. Trying to change practice area

3. The people you work with are terrible

4. variety 

 

If you are just moving for money, it’s got to be more than a possible 10 to 15% to make up for the risk imo. As a mid level associate you are clearly liked at your firm, for whatever reason that may not be the case at the next firm.

The people I work with are good, but there is one rainmaker who hates my guts pretty transparently and makes it known. Management thinks I’m below expectations in some regards.

money will be 20% if I make EP. At the associate level, maybe just 10k more a year. 

Variety of work could be slightly better.

Thanks for flagging that risk as well. I have a lot of fans where I am, but as noted, some haters.

1 hour ago, JurisPrudent said:

If you are a mid-level/senior associate and your sole goal is to become an equity partner, then you need to consider (i) what is the path to achieving that goal at your current firm and (ii) if there are hurdles to achieving that goal at your current firm, can those hurdles be overcome by moving to a firm across the street.

Those hurdles could include:

- There not being enough work in your group at your current firm to justify adding new partners

- There being new junior partners recently promoted in your group/associates ahead of you likely to block your path to partnership

- You not being viewed internally as a viable candidate for partnership (which could be for a variety of reasons)

If the group at your firm is just slow or if there are others ahead of you in the pipeline, then a lateral move may make sense. If what's blocking that path is you, then a lateral move is unlikely to help and you should instead concentrate on working on whatever those actual or perceived deficiencies are.

Ultimately, the decision as to whether to promote someone to equity partnership depends on whether there is a business case for doing so. It's generally not a question of "do we like this associate and do they do good work" but instead "does it make business sense for the firm to add this person to our ownership group". Want to be an equity partner? Build yourself a business case and make yourself indispensable. If the opportunity to build that business case isn't available at your current firm for reasons that are outside your control - then it may make sense to look at options across the street (but, as Cool-name noted, leaving a firm where you are known and liked comes with risk, so shouldn't be done lightly).

Thanks for the thoughtful response. The biggest hurdle right now is not enough billable work in my area, and a lot of competing associates in and around my year in the same position. Next is management indicating they don’t like certain aspects of me, and one EP in my group who thinks very poorly of me. A lot of this is tied to the little billable work available. Otherwise, I am highly liked by the rest, and the path to partner is fairly easy to obtain from what I hear and see.

 

A part of me thinks I should start fresh somewhere else.

[JurisPrudent]

45 minutes ago, Pancake2024 said:

Next is management indicating they don’t like certain aspects of me, and one EP in my group who thinks very poorly of me.

Those are pretty big hurdles...

Unless you have other partners who are truly going to champion your cause (or you're able to build and maintain your own book of business), I wouldn't feel great about your path to equity partnership at your current shop.

[Pancake2024]

1 hour ago, JurisPrudent said:

Those are pretty big hurdles...

Unless you have other partners who are truly going to champion your cause (or you're able to build and maintain your own book of business), I wouldn't feel great about your path to equity partnership at your current shop.

Thanks - I do have a handful of EPs who will and have spoken up for me. It’s a hard decision… 

[JackoMcSnacko]

47 minutes ago, Pancake2024 said:

Thanks - I do have a handful of EPs who will and have spoken up for me. It’s a hard decision… 

This issue sounds like it depends on the size of your group.

[Pancake2024]

2 hours ago, JackoMcSnacko said:

This issue sounds like it depends on the size of your group.

It’s a pretty big group