Derail from: How do I stay positive? (spliced)

[Thrive92]

2 hours ago, ZineZ said:

This seems like advice that should be given by a mental health professional. OP has not been professionally diagnosed with anything and only started law school recently. A counsellor would be better able to judge whether OP needs to seek further assistance. 

Hence is the reason why I told OP to seek not only a counselor but also a family doctor and describe his/her/their symptoms. The advice that you specifically pointed out as being premature is a relatively common knowledge and so it shouldn't necessarily be seen as a specific advice but instead something that OP should keep in mind, and a doctor would not prescribe such medications without being certain that the patient meets the diagnosis of depression/anxiety.

In other words, its an advice that cannot harm OP in any way imaginable. It is not an advice that is given only from mental health professionals.

4 hours ago, Barry said:

are you a clinical psychologist? 

No but I have been in a similar boat as OP before -- I also have a major in psychology, which really means nothing and is not even close to being a clinical psychologist in any sense of the word, but very early on into the major you learn that a two - pronged approach towards treating depression and anxiety with medications and therapy is much more effective than doing one at a time.

The advice was also given to me by my family doctor as I was refilling my anti anxiety/antidepressant medications early on into the treatment.

In other words, despite the fact that I am not a clinical psychologist, I think I know what I am talking about in this subject (ONLY for depression/anxiety) and you should also take in this knowledge as not necessarily a specific clinician's advice, but general advice.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Thrive92

[GGrievous]

9 hours ago, Thrive92 said:

n other words, despite the fact that I am not a clinical psychologist, I think I know what I am talking about in this subject (ONLY for depression/anxiety) and you should also take in this knowledge as not necessarily a specific clinician's advice, but general advice.

No… just no.. stop now. 

[Thrive92]

Just now, Barry said:

No… just no.. stop now. 

A bit too broad of a statement for my taste. Would you like to specify what you would like me to stop now?

[Hegdis]

5 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

A bit too broad of a statement for my taste. Would you like to specify what you would like me to stop now?

How about refraining from giving medical advice? It’s one thing to relay your personal experience. It’s another to make definite statements regarding other people’s care. “Consult a professional” is best. 

[GGrievous]

9 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

A bit too broad of a statement for my taste. Would you like to specify what you would like me to stop now?

I really would not like to specify this absolutely absurd line of discussion. I actually can’t believe a law student isn’t able to see the issue here.

you’re making very bold blanket statements and giving medical advice based on a rudimentary understanding of a basic idea from your undergrad class, and advice a doctor gave for your situation. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by Barry

[Thrive92]

Just now, Hegdis said:

How about refraining from giving medical advice? It’s one thing to relay your personal experience. It’s another to make definite statements regarding other people’s care. “Consult a professional” is best. 

I am not giving medical advice. The fact that anyone sees the statement indicating that combination of counseling and medication are much more effective to combat depression and anxiety rather than to do one treatment method at a time is frankly quite dumb seeing as how the information can be cited from a psychology textbook that can be bought in just about every bookstore in Canada

[GGrievous]

2 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

combination of counseling and medication are much more effective to combat depression and anxiety rather than to do one treatment method at a time

This is 10000% not true and you need to stop. 

[Thrive92]

2 minutes ago, Barry said:

I really would not like to specify this absolutely absurd line of discussion. I actually can’t believe a law student isn’t able to see the issue here.

you’re making very bold blanket statements and giving medical advice based on a rudimentary understanding of a basic idea from your undergrad class, and advice a doctor gave for your situation. 

A bold blanket statement? Medical advice? What are you talking about. Are we discussing about the same content here, or are you lost?

The fact that you see any content that I have posted above as medical advice is actually kind of funny to me as you clearly have no idea what you are typing about and making accusations that I am giving medical advice when such information can be found by a quick google search. (keep in mind barry, a google search does not constitute a medical advice, nor would a statement from a psychology textbook).

[Hegdis]

4 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

I am not giving medical advice. The fact that anyone sees the statement indicating that combination of counseling and medication are much more effective to combat depression and anxiety rather than to do one treatment method at a time is frankly quite dumb seeing as how the information can be cited from a psychology textbook that can be bought in just about every bookstore in Canada

This isn’t true for everyone. if it was true for you, congratulations. 

[Thrive92]

1 minute ago, Barry said:

This is 10000% not true and you need to stop. 

This is getting more entertaining by the hour. Please do tell me how this is untrue.

[GGrievous]

This is why I don’t have friends in law school. Anyway, I’m done with this.

OP - if you ever need to vent my DM’s are open. I guarantee I will relate to way you’re going through and promise you’re not alone. 

[Pantalaimon]

3 minutes ago, Barry said:

I really would not like to specify this absolutely absurd line of discussion. I actually can’t believe a law student isn’t able to see the issue here.

you’re making very bold blanket statements and giving medical advice based on a rudimentary understanding of a basic idea from your undergrad class, and advice a doctor gave for your situation. 

The part of Thrive's post immediately prior to the line being quoted is "I would also highly recommend you go see your family doctor (or those online doctor services that you can access from the internet) and get prescriptions". If "go see your doctor" is medical advice, this entire forum has a problem because everything here is legal advice. Perhaps it should have been "and ask about getting a prescription" but I think his position has been subsequently clarified.

[Thrive92]

5 minutes ago, Hegdis said:

This isn’t true for everyone. if it was true for you, congratulations. 

You're right it is not true for everyone, just like how not everyone may respond the same to the same kind of antidepressant medications, and just like how two pupils being taught by the same teacher do not yield the same grades. The fact that there is a chance that it may not work for some should not warrant discouraging the advice that the combination of two types of treatment for depression/anxiety would provide better results.

 

5 minutes ago, Barry said:

This is why I don’t have friends in law school. Anyway, I’m done with this.

Still waiting on how my statements are "10000% not true". Take your time -- I'll be here.

 

Edited September 30, 2021 by Thrive92

[GGrievous]

11 minutes ago, Pantalaimon said:

The part of Thrive's post immediately prior to the line being quoted is "I would also highly recommend you go see your family doctor (or those online doctor services that you can access from the internet) and get prescriptions". If "go see your doctor" is medical advice, this entire forum has a problem because everything here is legal advice. Perhaps it should have been "and ask about getting a prescription" but I think his position has been subsequently clarified.

I know I said I was done but I’m gonna do on more. I’m pretty sure if as a volunteer at the clinic I told someone that going to trial is much more effective than pleading. I would be in some serious trouble. So no there’s no huge problem. It’s just this nonsense. 
 

Ok time for a rage break. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by Barry

[Hegdis]

5 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

The fact that there is a chance that it may not work for some should not warrant discouraging the advice that the combination of two types of treatment for depression/anxiety would provide better results.

Thanks for the clarification. 

[Thrive92]

8 minutes ago, Barry said:

I’m pretty sure if I told a client, as a legal agent, that going to trial is much more effective than pleading.

Your example fails in the sense that I am not acting as a "legal agent", or in this case a medical professional. Also, comparing my advice to "going to trial is much more effective than pleading" is inaccurate as that is your advice on a case that I have no idea whether that is true or not, whereas for this situation, I know I am correct.

As you have stated to me a few minutes ago:

No… just no.. stop now. 

Btw, still waiting on how my statements are "10000% not true".

3 minutes ago, Hegdis said:

Thanks for the clarification. 

No problem at all. Feel free to also ask me of any advice  that can be found as easy as a quick google search which is not a medical advice.

Edited September 30, 2021 by Thrive92

[Yogurt Baron]

25 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

This is getting more entertaining by the hour.

For some of us more than others.

Mods, could we maybe get a splice so that our already-stressed OP won't have to deal with...whatever just broke out here?

[BlockedQuebecois]

22 minutes ago, Barry said:

I know I said I was done but I’m gonna do on more. I’m pretty sure if I told a client, as a legal agent, that going to trial is much more effective than pleading. I would be in some serious trouble. So no there’s no huge problem. It’s just this nonsense. 

What are you even trying to say here? 

Anyways, you're actually all wrong (and also all right, but let's focus on the wrong part).

Barry, you're wrong because there is quite a bit of evidence that people with depression have better outcomes when psychotherapy and medication are combined. So you're wrong to say this is "1000% not true". 

Thrive is wrong, too, because the evidence suggests that combining medicine and psychotherapy is not more effective than psychotherapy alone for people with anxiety disorders. 

The only reason I'm bothering to chime in on this is because OP (or another reader) might read Barry's comments and get it in their head that all they need is therapy and medication is worthless if they're in therapy, and they might similarly read Thrive's posts and think they absolutely need both. In either case, it would be unfortunate for that individual to doctor shop until they found one willing to follow the advice here, rather than going in with an open mind to find a solution with their healthcare practitioner. 

Also, OP (or anyone else reading this) shouldn't rely on a counsellor to suggest getting medication. Counsellors aren't doctors, and they often aren't allowed to recommend medication or even visiting with a GP. OP should meet with both a counsellor and a doctor in order to discuss their options. Most doctors these days will recommend counselling before medication, anyways, but depending on the individual's mental state it might be best to start both immediately. 

Edited September 30, 2021 by BlockedQuebecois

[GGrievous]

5 minutes ago, BlockedQuebecois said:

arry, you're wrong because there is quite a bit of evidence that people with depression have better outcomes when psychotherapy and medication are combined.

There’s quite a bit of evidence to the contrary, but in any event it is still 10000% wrong to say it’s always more effective. So you’re wrong, and disappointing. 

[Thrive92]

6 minutes ago, BlockedQuebecois said:

Thrive is wrong, too, because the evidence suggests that combining medicine and psychotherapy is not more effective than psychotherapy alone for people with anxiety disorders. 

I stand corrected; I must have mistakenly applied the evidence for depression for anxiety as well.

OP, I understand how this may all be confusing because of @Barry's equivalence of heckling in this forum, but I echo what @BlockedQuebecois has recommended above -- please go see both medical professionals for your depression and anxiety. And please know that although the combination of medication and therapy may not be effective for anxiety, there is relatively enough evidence that it may work on depression (i use the word "relatively" because although it may not work for you, there is little downside on trying it).

And please know that I am not a medical professional nor are any of my advices given here medical advice; it pains me to actually type this out but apparently some people are hella confused and would jeer at me with statements like "I actually can’t believe a law student isn’t able to see the issue here."

Good luck OP.

Just now, Barry said:

There’s quite a bit of evidence to the contrary, but in any event it is still 10000% wrong to say it’s always more effective. So you’re wrong, and disappointing. 

You ever heard of the dunning - kruger effect?

[GGrievous]

3 minutes ago, Thrive92 said:

there is little downside on trying it).

Oh my fucking god 

[Pantalaimon]

2 minutes ago, Barry said:

There’s quite a bit of evidence to the contrary, but in any event it is still 10000% wrong to say it’s always more effective. So you’re wrong, and disappointing. 

How is being this black and white about it any different than what you were jumping all over Thrive for doing? Besides, the part you were busy quoting - IMO unfairly and out of context - is:

Quote

A combination of counseling and medication are much more effective to combat depression and anxiety rather than to do one treatment method at a time.

Nothing in there about "always".

Anyways, as usual BQ has captured my thoughts much more eloquently than I could have put it.

[Thrive92]

Just now, Barry said:

Oh my fucking god 

Barry again -- A bit too broad of a statement for my taste. Would you like to specify why you responded with vulgarity to that particular statement?

We've come full circle and you still can't seem to pick yourself up from this issue of thinking that I know what you are thinking. Slow down and elaborate friendo.

[PulpFiction]

@Barry @Thrive92  You two should meet up and fight. (just joking, kind of) 

 

[Thrive92]

Just now, PulpFiction said:

@Barry @Thrive92  You two should meet up and fight. (just joking, kind of) 

 

And meet Barry in person? I'd rather not. He's unpleasant as he is online.