Chances
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What's Happening
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9
Rejected 2024
portal updated to “not offered admission”, no email yet cgpa: 3.48 b2: 3.64 l2: 3.56 lsat: 157 (only jan 2024) -
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Rejected 2024
First R cGPA: 3.59 LSAT: 160 I applied via the mature applicant category. -
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Discretionary 2024
Anybody else on the waitlist under the D category? My stats are 3.8 gpa and 164 lsat. Not counting on my chances too much at the moment. -
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Finished law school, feeling defeated
I think it's only human nature to feel nostalgic and perhaps a bit sad about such an important chapter of your life coming to a close. I did. I wouldn't call it "defeated", but I can understand why OP might. The solution is to throw yourself into articling / your clerkship. The feeling will quickly pass. -
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Would it be a mistake to only apply for articling positions in Toronto/the GTA rather than also applying in Ottawa/Northern Ontario?
Hi everyone, I would really appreciate your thoughts on this question. For several reasons, I have a strong preference for returning to Toronto/the GTA for work. However, the deadline to accept an articling offer in Ottawa/Northern Ontario is ahead of the application due date for most Toronto/GTA positions. If I were to be offered a position, I would have to decide whether or not to accept it before I would have the chance to be considered in Toronto/the GTA. I realize articling is only one more year, but I am concerned that it would hurt my reputation and burn a bridge if I didn't accept a hire-back offer at the end (if I were to be offered a position). I have also heard it can be challenging to be hired as a first year associate, so I would ideally like to article at a place where I might be hired back and where I would like to stay long term. So far, my grades are all As and Bs (with a few more grades in the B range than the A range). I have some law-related work experience and will have a law job this summer (but it doesn't lead to an articling position). I'm attending a mid-tier Ontario school. I am most interested in criminal law but I plan to apply to positions in a variety of practice areas to increase my chances of being hired somewhere. My priority is getting licensed, regardless of where I need to move to make it happen. Obviously, I realize that my odds of getting something will be better if I send out more applications. I'm just wondering if only applying to Toronto/GTA jobs would seriously jeopardize my chances of landing somewhere. Thank you to anyone who answers 🙂 -
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Currently down after a rejection. Please chance me for TRU, Bora Laskin, uOttawa. Already waitlisted at UNB. Rejected at UBC, UVIC, and Windsor Single
You never know, but Ottawa and TRU are most likely a no. I don't really know what Lakehead looks for so won't chime in on that one, and UNB has waitlisted you so obviously a chance there. A discretionary application helps with your GPA and you have an upward trajectory, but your LSAT hurts you. I'd operate under the assumption you're not getting in this year and try to get your LSAT up to a 160. Obviously its a decision only you can make, but I feel like you should consider whether a move to Thunder Bay or Fredericton makes sense for you if those are your only options this year. If you can hit 160, I feel like you'd have a shot next cycle at a school in Western Canada. If you intend to practice in BC, I expect it'd be tricky to do so coming from UNB or Lakehead - though maybe that's that beats another year of waiting. Just something to consider. -
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Just accepted and don’t know what to do!
To be blunt, law school generally does not prepare students for the practice of law. You're not going to learn how to redline a contract or collect on a client bill or negotiate a settlement. As far as "quality of education", other commenters have more or less addressed this above. I'm a TRU alum but I'd imagine the quality is pretty similar between TRU and UNB. I think you should be making your decision based on where you want to practice law. If you want to work in BC/AB, TRU is a no brainer.- 2
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TMU VS Ottawa
When I was at TRU, having too many lawyers/judges as adjuncts was actually a criticism. It was a sign that TRU didn't have enough full time profs. Having practicing lawyers/retired judges teach electives is great. Having them teach core courses is a bit of an issue.- 1
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Currently down after a rejection. Please chance me for TRU, Bora Laskin, uOttawa. Already waitlisted at UNB. Rejected at UBC, UVIC, and Windsor Single
Although discretionary can be a wildcard I'd say your chances aren't great unless you improve your LSAT (I'm assuming you have graduated so you can't fix your GPA ). Although you have an access claim and good softs, those often aren't enough when you are below average on both GPA and LSAT. I'm sure if you put your mind to it you can crack the 160s! -
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Building criminal law competency without having previous experiences
Firms outside of the major cities are more likely to have a more diversified practice. I only say this because I assume you ( @beachhouse ) have some experience in an area of law other than criminal and you just want to test the waters. So if you works for a smaller town civil/real estate/family/criminal form you might be able to take on some criminal files without too much commitment, and you'd perhaps have the flexibility of getting out of the crim or deeper into crim based on your preferences once you know if you like it.- 1
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Entering 1L Advice
Let's assume your goal is to get good grades in 1L. You should have other goals, like building relationships and finding the area of law that interests you, but let's assume you are just concerned with performing well academically. 1L throws a million things at you: Read 5 very large and very dense books Read a million optional articles Join clubs Attend this optional session and that optional session The end goal for most courses is a very short, 100% exam. You spend 2 or 3 hours tying up the key points in response to a few fact patterns, and then it's over. First year left me with the felling "What do I get to demonstrate my knowledge of the 100 obscure articles you made me read?" and "When do I get the chance to demonstrate the knowledge I gained from 500 hours of studying without an extreme time crunch?" You don't. You don't have to know much about the law to do well on exams. Students with a very basic knowledge who issue spot fast are lighting fast as putting it down on paper are much more likely to get an A than a student who knows much more but needs more time to formulate an answer. You can actually get bogged down with too much knowledge. Keep your summaries brief. Cases really boil down to a takeaway of 100 words or less. You may need to read full cases to get a feel for how the law works, but in the end you will not have time on an exam to say more than a sentence or two about a case (at most). Students who are able to make their point in 40 words in 60 seconds and cite a case as authority and the appropriate section in the Criminal Code or Rules of Civil procedure get the A. The student who could give an hour long speech on the case might get a B. -
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Orientation/First Week of Classes
At Osgoode (unless they changed it) you will do only two courses for the first 10 days or so: Legal Process 1 (LP1) and Ethical Lawyering in a Global Community (ELGC). LP1 is a course with a ton of little assignments. Slightly bigger assignments include a memo and a factum. ELGC is as essay course, and what is discussed in class is not even that related to the actual performance outcome that will affect your grade. People in ELGC basically just talk about their opinions of different ethical issues. Most students do not speak at all. These classes are recorded (unless they changed that), so you can listen to the lectures later. In fact, by 2L and 3L I found that class attendance was below 50% for most courses because students were relying on the recordings. Be aware that there may be "participation" component to ELGC and LP1, so check eClass regularly and submit what you need to online even if you are out of the country (it might be brief reflection on an ethical issues, etc). If you are concerned about the "orientation" component (i.e. anything not related to a specific course), I found all of that completely worthless expect perhaps if you want to join a club (i.e. the Business Law Association or whatever). I don't recall much of importance happening in my year before Sept 1, and even then the things I thought were important turned out to be not so important (i.e. Reading the countless optional readings). -
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Finished law school, feeling defeated
I suppose emotions about finishing law school are different for different people. I moved all of my belongings out of my apartment yesterday, and it gives me a weird mix of emotions. Law school was a big part of our lives for a lot of years. Most of us put a lot of pressure on ourselves and put a lot of time towards our studies. I liked my routine and the way I had everything set up. I liked the way my favourite chair was set up, the lighting, and where I stored my food and cooking supplies. I liked the privacy and the neighbourhood. Leaving law school is like a change of employment, residence, and social circle all at the same time. There's also the "What do I do now?" element. Articling does not start for a few months. There's the bar exam to study for of course, but PR and civil procedure has got to be the most boring thing I have ever read. Some people reading this might understand, and others might wonder WTF I'm talking about. But I'm sure I'll get over it in a week at most.- 1
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Chances for Osgoode/Queens?
Yeah, the whole "aim for a 165" culture tends to annoy me. 165 is the 89th percentile---in order to do better than 89% of people writing the test, you've got to have some level of natural aptitude. "What if I just study really hard?" Those 89% of people are studying really hard too. "Oh, what if I just study really, really hard?" Yeah, that second "really" oughta do it. Seriously, though - coming in without having written an LSAT and saying, "Hey, what if I'm better at it than 89% of people?" is like saying, "I don't know how tall I am, but can I play in the NBA if I'm 7'4?" And, like, sure you can, but that's a big "if". Best of luck - come back when you have a stronger idea of what you can do, and we'll be able to give better advice.- 1
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